Thanks Joe,

   I've just started a couple of generator projects and hope to have some pics to post soon.

-brooks

Hi Grant,
 
 
I'm wary of gov't funded research programs. Ideas sometimes get bogged down for years in university research programs with little progress. Example, the Stirling Cycle engine became subject of gov't research funding during the early 1970's to improve its efficiency. By the late 1990's little improvement had been achieved when NASA elected to fund research into thermoacoustic engines. Many makers of Stirling Cycle engines went out of business.
 
 
Gov't funded research into high-altitude wind energy could delay by many years the introduction of such technology to market.
 
 
Harry
 

---

---

Windows Live Messenger makes it easier to stay in touch - learn how!

Dear Harry,

Ya,

  I'm working on some prototypes in my spare time with help from Dave Santos and when we use to do art grants we would spend a lot of time jumping thru the hoops, it helps get you focused but right now I just like to work at my own pace and without the red tape hassles. My main objectives for now are to mechanicly automate the line tension and spool controls and the same for the motion controls of the kites. I have an idea for a single kite single line version that uses a control system to keep it in a steady figure 8 either side to side or front and back or possably both. The kite is in the works but after several months of really high winds it has become rather calm lately(of course).

-brooks

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

Saul Griffith makes video disclosure. 

Discussion open.

Positives, errors, challenges?

Starter:

Why did he pick 1000 years for kite history when kites have been for over 3000 years? 

Request: Would someone post the text of the video?

KiteLab had an automous kite energy control before Makani; so a key claim in the video seems untenable.

Kites are well proven as are ground-based electrical generators. There is potential for the two to be combined into a workable electrical generation technology. However, Griffith is moving into uncharted territory using kites to carry airborne electrical generation equipment.
 
Harry

---

To: AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
From: joefaust333@gmail.com
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 18:45:23 +0000
Subject: [AirborneWindEnergy] Makani Power, Inc. video disclosure

Discussion is open.

Starters:
[ ] Request: Someone send in text of the video.
Points?

Note: The remark about first automous system is not fact. At least KiteLab had operating an automous kite energy system.

Note: The 1000 year remark gave me a wince. What happenened to 3000 years or more of kite history?

Note: The 300 ft. remark? Why not mention 10,000 ft ?

Note: I like that he said "We need to support all the kids ... making these things." There are 50 researchers open to receive support.

Video of topic is in various places:
http://www.ted.com/talks/view/id/492
Saul Griffith: Inventing a super-kite to tap the energy of high-altitude wind

Here's two more WECS alternatives:

http://www.hicon.us/gpage7.html

http://www.hicon.us/gpage16.html

But these are not kite systems.

Hey Gang,
sorry for this off topic but someone has been sending out some spam from an account using my brooksbot75 email name to all the people on my main mail account list. Delete it right away. So much for the spyware security(3 layers).
-brooks

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

Thanks for posting this . . . the concepts are interesting.
 
 
Harry

---

To: AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
From: goeggel@hawaii.rr.com
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 01:41:24 +0000
Subject: [AirborneWindEnergy] Wind Energy

--- In AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com, "aieageoff" <goeggel@... Some people, including myself, see your systems as kite systems using kytoons where some lift is occurring besides the buoyant gas lift. The kite line is the tether of the tube, though short; the high torsion of the short kytoon line drives your generator. From the first instant of seeing your proposals, I embraced them in my kite universe.

Lift,
Joe Faust

Hi All,

first have to say that I'm also surprised at some of the comments. I
thought that Saul's talk was bang on for the audience he was giving it
to, though he could have devoted a slide to explaining how the generator
is driven.
The claim for 'first autonomous power generation' I thought was a bit
cheeky given that skysails have stated for years that their systems can
be used to generate auxilary power and with tracking and active control
systems. Not to mention the other groups/companies, so maybe I'm naive
but I don't understand why he said that.

As for Makani's status and funding, well, it is a great team of highly
talented people, that has allowed them to attract great funding and the
corrollory to that funding is that they have to be careful about what
they disclose. How they spend that money is their own business, everyone
else working on a shoestring may well make new partnerships, discover
novel cost efficencies and new techniques that they may not have given a
huge budget, I know I have. (i'd still take the money though!)
So companies need IP, Academics are expected to publish, and there are
some people independently working on projects that they want to be open
source and collaborative. I don't see why these approaches can't
coexist! In fact if we want a diversity of technical approaches
attempted, we need all these to go assessed in parallel for the best to
survive commercially.

The very existance of a company like Makani means that there is a high
profile cheerleader bringing attention (and probably more investment) to
the field, and at the same time making it appear less 'far-out'. Surely
this must be to the benefit of everyone? As for inspiration, it is clear
from some of the comments on TED that that talk inspired a number of
people. I used it to help get a very talented engineering undergrad
intern over the summer.

Also important are those workers who put their ideas out in to the
public domain. Saul himself rightfully credited Miles Loyd, without that
paper I don't know if I'd be working on kite power now.

As for the patent app, there are some novel elements in there. The
depressing overextended and all-encompassing scope of that particular
application is not unique, in fact I have seen that in pretty much every
single one of the kite energy patents and seems to be just the way these
things end up once they leave the desk of the patent attorneys, it is
frustrating but that is the reality we're faced with. The kitegen
patents also seemed to claim the whole concept of steering a kite, -with
a machine, that ..wait for it... uses actuators to pull on steering
lines! shock, massive novelty there! There also seems to be enormous
overlap between the claims of a good deal of the patents so i'm sure the
lawyers will make some money when the field matures.

As for good natured commercial competition, well lets hope that we get
it, I see Bas in Delft has started a commercial project: Ampyx Power,
and I wish good luck to him. I hope he can get some substantial
investment asap.

Cheers

Allister


\

This is why Makani's paid spokesperson is furiously blowing smoke:   The path to airworthy high-mass UAVs is long & rigorous. Current third-generation UAVs are highly restricted due to unacceptable failure rates. It takes tens of billions of dollars & millions of flight hours over decades to iron out the kinks. Makani simply can't do in NAS what its hype proposes.   On the other hand low-altitude low-mass AWE systems are NAS preapproved & working well. They will generate gigawatts long before Makani.   Roland E. Weibel's excellent study is Essential Reading for all AWE developers-   http://dspace.mit.edu/handle/1721.1/34955

Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the
AirborneWindEnergy group:

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not the full already viewable message.

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Thanks!

Harry,

Hi Chris,
 
 
SkyWindPower and Magenn are looking at carry electrical generation equipment aloft and transmitting the electric power down insulated tethers. I was once a proponent of such technology, however, there is great merit to using ground-based generation equipment.
 
Harry
 

---

To: AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
From: christopher.m.carlin@btinternet.com
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:48:29 +0000
Subject: Re: [AirborneWindEnergy] Makani Power, Inc. video disclosure

---

Make your Messenger window look the way you want. Express Yourself!

Hey Gang,

  one issue not being addressed by the overall alt energy community is the dwindling supply of available copper being mined from the know sources. This could be a pro for the ground generator method and should be included in a paper to the DOE. I had proposed several ideas addressing this concern to the Google 10 to the 100th contest, ideas like putting windmills and solar panels on parking lot street lamps to offset the need for heavier gage wire, although there could be just as much needed wire for the generators themselves depending on the distance to the main power source. I wanted to propose this to the DOE request but I was unable to get the required sign-up form to work so if anyone wants to include it in their paper feel free to do so.

-brooks

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

At the recent disclosure talk by Saul Griffith at frame time 01:20  upon saying "...like Langley,"  he showed the photograph of the kited passenger which kite now we find is by Charles H. Lamson with some human passenger.  

Thank you, Team Drachen Foundation (Dave Lang, Scott Skinner, Jan Desimpleaere),   for help in making this clarification possible. 
http://tinyurl.com/SaulGriffith888disclosurebrief

http://d.yimg.com/kq/groups/24857016/sn/1788970734/name/PassengerInLamsonKite.jpg Small image is viewable online in group's Photos section.

This topic thread can be branched.

What claims will survive as inventive? How might this exerice help to reach the target of this group of rapid development of effective AWE?

Recent application published that was filed Sept. 7, 2007

http://tinyurl.com/PatApplMarch2009BIMODALKITE

The applying inventor list:
Griffith; Saul; (San Francisco, CA) ;
Lynn; Peter; (Alameda, CA) ;
Montague; Don; (Maui, HI) ;
Hardham; Corwin; (San Francisco, CA) Patent pending approval process will take time. Filed: September 13, 2007 What claims will survive?
Discuss in group.
Assignee: Makani Power, Inc.

Sorry folks, independent AWE lost, the Google juggernaut wins again, Makani's patent, as Allister noted, contains definite novel elements. But British understatement doesn't begin to suggest the scope of Makani's coup. They have succeeded in patenting something called "first tether element" & "second tether element", which i had no idea even existed. As my Google Search, *sigh*, confirms- it is novel art.   Dave Culp knew, but was under NDA. Still, he tried to warn me by wiggling his eyebrows. Allister finally clued me when he mentioned that we now had an industry cheerleader. i am so embarrassed. Who knew AWE had a cheerleader? So i was a barking dog about to maul our cheerleader. My tail is wagging between my legs. . i consulted-with KiteLab's "attorney", a disbarred lawyer friend who drinks cheap beer, & he marveled. It takes a Google-Class Silicon Valley IP Legal Firm to fully grasp how to shepherd a first & second tether element into an AWE marketing monopoly. "Third" is DOA in The SV, so i came up with "n-th tether element", but who would buy that? i can't even calculate the Tether Element Values (TEVs) of the also-ran hum-drum passive-stability continuous-loop & reciprocating-line schemes KiteLab bet on.   Anyone want my kite handles? i can't afford to pay royalties to Makani after blowing my life-savings on amateur open-source AWE research. Groan, its 78 on Maui, but 40 here in Ilwaco, & the wind howls with laughter.   dave santos KiteLab (for sale cheap) Ilwaco, WA Austin, TX

Please substitute "first tether-force configuration" & "second tether force configuration" for "first (& second) tether element" in my last post. All this is too complicated for me still & it was late when i posted.   My profoundest sympathy for all independent AWE folks wiped out by the Bimodal Kite.   Sputnik Flip-Wings make good shoe-shine rags, now fire-sale priced.

My dated answer for the moment:
In reading the APPLICATION for a patent (it is not yet an approved patent), my today's first blush:
I find no novel invention in the application besides construction of words for what has already been well established as a working kite, that is, a kite that is flown to do some work or produce energy. Multiple lines (two "bi" or more) have been employed to effect work or make electricity in priorly demonstrated arts).

Please prove me wrong, as I like seeing innovation.

Joe Faust
March 27, 2009.
===========================================================

Chill out Folks :-),

I am afraid that makani has already been scooped by Skysails (the
German competitor to Culp et al). The last time I looked at their
patent applications, they had "actually invented kites".....well that
is a bit exaggerated, but I was shocked when I first read the Skysail
patents, thinking there is no room left for invention in
power-kitedom :-) (Dave Culp assured me not to worry). There seems
to be a certain ignorance on the part of patent attorneys related to
where kites came from, and how long folks have been messing with
them. Remember, a patent is only an entre' into defending one's
presumed original idea.....they do not forbid, detect, nor
automatically enforce infringement, nor insure one will prevail in
litigation.

My guess is, if any of the technical folks at makani had written that
patent it would have been more to the point....the attorneys likely
"pulled legal rank" and "got their way" regarding
generalization....which can be a double edged sword in patent-land.

Dave L



At 5:35 PM +0000 3/27/09, Joe Faust wrote:

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AirborneWindEnergy
group.

File : /MakaniPower/ApplicationBimodalKiteSystem2007.pdf
Uploaded by : joe_f_90032 <joefaust333@gmail.com Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AirborneWindEnergy/files/MakaniPower/ApplicationBimodalKiteSystem2007.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/web/index.htmlfiles

Regards,

joe_f_90032 <joefaust333@gmail.com

  Don't toss them in the fireplace just yet, while all of this has been going on I have been writing the outline for a movie script both about the current development of the industry and some possible Bruce Sterling style futuristic visions of what may come. I always assumed that when you have a all knowing/seeing/collecting powerhouse like Google funding something you can bet they will include everything the open source folks would propose into their patent. Just wondering if anyone else ever heard anything back from the Google 10 to the 100th contest which was supposed to have been opened to public voting back in February, of was it just a blatant ploy to sucker a bunch of hopeful contributions into giving up their ideas for free. with no intentions to ever actually include them in the development process. I still have some ideas for the implementation of their now proprietary tech that probably has not been fully covered and it is on such a small scale and with a humanitarian angle that they would been shamed if they attempted to shut us down for it.

   Personally I don't really blame them for wanting to get all the detail patented. It's how they share that tech in the future that will show their true colors. If they turn into another version of big oil, with It's habit of buying up any competing tech and putting it on the shelf to bury any possible competition, like in "who killed the electric car?", now that would be a reason for truly despising them.

-brooks

UniModal Work Kite

Some pioneers have found several ways to have a unimodal work kite to generate electricity where the system uses a ground-based electrical generator.

This thread invites brief descriptions of the various sorts of unimodal work kite systems.

For a long time bimodal work kite systems have been examined and demonstrated, even trimodal kite systems. This thread invites a placing on the table brief descriptions of unimodal work kite systems. N-modal work kite systems will be developed (their invention has occurred for decades, but full-blown product development is yet to occur).

Call for brief description of VARIOUS UNIMODAL (single-tether force confuration). Brief for this intro threas? Perhaps under 300 words? Each variant can branch to a different thread. This is mainly for an overview list.

1.
2.
3.
...
All are invited to send in a brief description of a unimodal work kite system.

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AirborneWindEnergy
group.

File : /MakaniPower/AppFeb2009Controll.pdf
Uploaded by : joe_f_90032 <joefaust333@gmail.com Description : Control. Application, not yet approved.

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AirborneWindEnergy/files/MakaniPower/AppFeb2009Controll.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/web/index.htmlfiles

Regards,

joe_f_90032 <joefaust333@gmail.com

If you get your kicks over righteous indignation; have a gander at Skysail's many kite patents (numbers on their website; www.skysails.info) (patents include claims of first and novel use of kites to pull things, use of string or rope to hold kites to ground, first novel use of reels, multiple lines, line/pulley systems to alter line lengths, a host of others), or schmmelpfennig (first novel use of bridles to control shape of parafoil). Others (recently) have patented reflex airfoils (claimed novelty is that no-one else had patented these *for kites*), tracks along or around the deck of ships, boats, or platforms on the ground. Another for circular tracks; yet another for kites controlled by shifting weights from side to side. All of these are current "valid" patents, meaning filed--and granted--within the past 19 years. Nothing Makani's applied for holds a candle to these for audacity.

Skysails certainly offers some interesting technology
 
 
Harry
 

---

To: AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
From: dave@kiteship.com
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 22:58:39 -0500
Subject: [AirborneWindEnergy] Kite Patents

Unimodal work kite systems, as Joe has dubbed them, may be divided into two general classes, those with rotating elements like turbines & those with oscillating elements like flip-wings. Turbines are almost pure unimodal, the phase-space barely ruffled by multi-blades. A turbine towed at sea by a kite in cyclonic cycling is a rather unimodal. Oscillators have a more eccentric phase-space, symmetric oscillation being simpler, & "bimodal" reeling the dirtiest phase-space.   One "simple" oscillating kite is a quazi-stable singleline kite, typically with a shortened tail & elevated flywheel mass due to bad construction. Natural wind-fields are helical & oscillate a kite. A singleline kite can oscillate strongly in a shed vortice train caused by structure or terrain. These conditions naturally modulate tetherforce. Next in complexity is the lifter-suspended flip-wing or shunt-wing which inherently modulates tetherforce forcefully at high frequencies.   Fancier is to to stake out the brakelines of an unstable power kite so that it passively sweeps a figure--eight. As a practical matter the kite must be flown thru pulleys or rings suspended by an aerostat, lifter kite, structure, or terrain, to prevent crashing. A cable loop might be pulled by such a kite between two anchors placed across the wind.   Active controls represent the ultimate complexification of a simple problem. The Bimodal Kite can be viewed unimodally as a low period oscillator of low Q (Quality Factor), where considerable electromechanical complexity & thermodynamic efficiency is spent in slogging thru its cycle. A Flip-Wing by contrast is a higher Q device which "wants" to resonate.   There is much more that might be said than these crude highlights of the topic.

 

Thanks Dave Santos for a leading note on this thread. 

The two large branches might be expanded; I leave that open yet.  My note today is a question within the second branch --oscillating.   By "uniModal work kite" I did not intend the "uni" to be limited to "single-tether" but rather to "one" mode of operating.    If we are capturing the notions that way, then I invite a discussion of the Peter R. Payne and Charles McCutchen patent US 3987987  filed January 25, 1975, and approved October 26, 1976, where the drawings indicate a working of the loop's apex through two ground-based pulleys. The generators could be at the pulleys, at one pulley space, or set singularly between the two pulleys.

Do you analyze the system as being "unimodal" with kite oscillating behavior? 
As the kite drives left to right via several possible methods, the single loop (reaching to near kite via two side-up lines) moves one way and then the other way. The proper clutch would care for the two opposing directions of the loop's oscillating line.

www.aerowindpower.com AWP Jinwon Industry Co.

Replying to this thread topic could deepen the discussion of the AWE methods being explored by AWP.

http://www.aerowindpower.com/image0325/1.jpg
http://www.aerowindpower.com/wind.php
http://www.aerowindpower.com/image/move.gif

Their method is another kytoon-lofted turbine with conductive tether.

Oscillating-Wing Power Generator

Offer:
That replies to this thread or topic be with a focus the study made by Kevin D. Jones and Scott Davids. I also invite that the discussion enter the reference to wingmill studies by McKinney and DeLaurier. Then perhaps some of us will bring in a discussion of the flipper-wing of Dave Santos, if such is cousin to the wingmill of the subject paper.

Jones, K.D., Davids, S. and Platzer, M.F.,
"Oscillating-Wing Power Generator,"
ASME/JSME Joint Fluids Engineering Conference,
San Francisco, CA, July 18-23, 1999.

Full copy of the six page paper:
http://aa.nps.edu/~jones/publications/pdf/asmefedsm99-7050.pdf
or the same link made into a Tiny URL:
http://tinyurl.com/OscillatingWingPowerGeneration

ABSTRACT
Numerical and experimental methods are described for the
investigation of an oscillating-wing generator or wingmill. The
numerical approach applies a previously developed, unsteady, in-
compressible panel method incorporating a non-linear, deform-
ing wake model to compute the unsteady flow about an airfoil
undergoing specified pitch and plunge motions. An experimental
model is described which can duplicate much of the parameter-
space available to the panel method. Numerical results are pre-
sented demonstrating configurations that yield high efficiencies.
Results are compared to the wingmill experiments of McKinney
and DeLaurier.

Dave Santos confirmed to me that wingmill is cousin to FlipWing and that wingmill continues to be studied by others (references soon). Meanwhile several years of successful FlipWing (flipper wings) field testing continue to advance at a KiteLab. Some recent drawings and photographs can be part of this thread:
http://www.energykitesystems.net/DaveSantos/FlipWingTM/index.html

This will be a status dated snapshot of a relted article in Wikipedia. The article is thought to be part of this thread. It will be interesting to see later the full develpment of that article.  All are invited to improve that article at Wikipedia.  I have not yet any inputs to that article.

Here is today's text (anyone may edit the Wikipedia article):

=======================Dated Snapshot=====

Controlled aerodynamic instability phenomena

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The term controlled aerodynamic instability phenomena was first used by Cristiano Augusto Trein^[1] in the Nineteenth KKCNN Symposium on Civil Engineering ^[2] held in Kyoto – Japan in 2006. The concept is based on the idea that aerodynamic instability phenomena, such as Kármán vortex street, flutter, galloping and buffeting, can be driven into a controlled motion and be used to extract energy from the flow, becoming an alternative approach for wind power generation systems.

[edit] Justification

Nowadays, when a discussion is established around the theme wind power generation, what is promptly addressed is the image of a big wind turbine, with its turbine getting turned by the wind. However, some alternative approaches have already been proposed in the latter decades, showing that the wind turbine is not the only possibility for the exploitation of the wind for power generation purposes.

In 1977 Jeffery ^[3] experimented with an oscillating aerofoil system based on a vertically-mounted pivoting wing which flapped in the wind. Farthing^[4] discovered that this free flutter could automatically cease for high wind protection and developed floating and pile based models for pumping surface and well water as well as compressing air with auxiliary battery charging McKinney and DeLaurier ^[5] in 1981 proposed a system called wingmill, based on a rigid horizontal airfoil with articulated pitching and plunging to extract energy from the flow. This system has stimulated Moores^[6] in 2003 to conduct further investigations on applications of such idea.

Following the same trend, other studies have already been carried out, for example the flutter power generation system proposed by Isogai et al.^[7] in 2003, which uses the flutter instability caused by the wind on an aerofoil to extract energy from the flow. In this branch, Matsumoto et al. ^[8] went further, proposing enhancements for that system and assessing the feasibility of its usage with bluff bodies.

[edit] Controlled aerodynamic instability phenomena

The wind interacts with the obstacles it reaches in its way by transferring a part of its energy to those interactions, which are converted into forces over the bodies, leading them to different levels of motion, which are directly dependent on their aeroelastic and geometric characteristics. A large amount of studies and researches has been conducted concerning these interactions and their dependencies, aiming the understanding of the aerodynamic phenomena that arise due to them, such as the Kármán vortex street, galloping, buffeting and flutter, mainly regarding bluff bodies. By the understanding of such phenomena it is possible to predict instabilities and their consequent motions, feeding the designers with the data they need in order to arrange the structures properly.

In the great majority of the cases – e.g.: in civil buildings – such motions are useless and undesirable, in a manner that all the designing approaches are focused on avoiding them. However these instabilities may also be used in a profitable manner: if they are controlled and driven to a predictable motion, they can provide mechanical power supply to run, for example, turbines, machinery and electricity generators.

So by using the knowledge acquired by now regarding those aerodynamic instabilities and by developing new features, it is possible to propose ways to stimulate them to an optimal state, using them for power generation purposes. That way, alternative approaches to the windmill may be proposed and developed. Farthing (www.econologica.org/pt.htm) applies the practical requirements for a windmill to greatly whittle down the possibilities.

[edit] References an notes

=====================End of dated snapshot==

I've seen devices that meet this description attatched to roof of buildings. They're piezo-electric and are activated by wind. They deliver small amounts of power at higher efficiency and at less cost that small wind turbines mounted on towers.
 
Harry

---

To: AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
From: w.roeseler@comcast.net
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 04:24:12 +0000
Subject: Re: [AirborneWindEnergy] Re: Oscillating-Wing Power Generator by Kevin Jones || wingmill

Bill,
In support of your mention, I notice that:
Assuming de-construction of trees, de-leafing of fall season trees, leveling of old houses, putting out of commission poorly desinged airplanes, etc. are instance of work done, then flutter and buffet have been doing tremendous work every day around the world for millions on years. The wind's energy enters structures tether or not and frequently sets up oscillations that result in tearing apart structures until...with other processes, soil is made and enriched so new plants may be nourished. Capturing some of that flutter for making-energy-sake or for performing presecribed work would simple be receiving the gift of wind's flutter-induction capacity in a channeled manner for designed non-random purposes. Rapid Airborne Development (RAD) very well may have a large branch that capitalizes on flutter. Aviation so feared the rapid pitch-down nose-in WHACK; but now a branch of aviation: Energy kite systems ... will have an active branch that embraces the WHACK-opposite-WHACK,...repetitions; clutch the varied resultant tensions to rotary motion or pumping activity! Soak in the wind's flutter potential into energy sponges; empty those sponges to serve pointed purposes.
Thanks Bill,
Joe Faust

So far the "fluttermills" have only been built to very low levels of output . . . enough for single homes in under-developed and developing countries. There is the danger that the continual cyclic forces could cause damage to structures. Some oscillating wings have been mounted on poles and secured by weights and cables.
 
 
Harry
 

---

To: AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
From: joefaust333@gmail.com
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 23:49:18 +0000
Subject: [AirborneWindEnergy] Re: Oscillating-Wing Power Generator by Kevin Jones || wingmill