Messages in AirborneWindEnergy group.                          AWES 20437 to 20487 Page 302 of 440.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20437 From: edoishi Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Attention Aerotecture...

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20438 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Re: Stephan Schnez of ABB Corporate Research to speak on AWE at UFre

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20439 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Killer LLJ? Fw: Role of Surface Inversion & Solar Gain in Maxwell TX

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20440 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: Killer LLJ? Fw: Role of Surface Inversion & Solar Gain in Maxwel

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20441 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: Killer LLJ? Fw: Role of Surface Inversion & Solar Gain in Maxwel

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20442 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: "new" RC winged box kites

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20443 From: dave santos Date: 8/5/2016
Subject: Re: "new" RC winged box kites

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20444 From: Guillaume Ardoise Date: 8/6/2016
Subject: Re: "new" RC winged box kites

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20445 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: AWE fields of attention

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20446 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: AWEpowerpoint

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20448 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20449 From: Massimo Ippolito Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20450 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: SYSTEM AND PROCESS FOR MANAGING AND CONTROLLING THE FLIGHT OF WI

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20451 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Glen R. Bailey and his kite system for surveillance

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20452 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20453 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: GROUND STATION OF A TROPOSPHERIC WIND GENERATOR

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20454 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: Glen R. Bailey and his kite system for surveillance

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20455 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: WindLift Update

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20456 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Re: WindLift Update

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20457 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20458 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Energy Matters discussions

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20459 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Pulling births kiting.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20460 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: Pulling births kiting.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20461 From: snapscan_snapscan Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20462 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Pulling births kiting.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20463 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Pulling births kiting.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20464 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Moderator reports

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20465 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Moderator reports

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20466 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Facing the Stoppers

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20467 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: ARC-TYPE WING WITH IMPROVED SHOULDERS

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20468 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: A Small-Scale Prototype to Study the Take-Off of Tethered Rigid Airc

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20469 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Simplified model of offshore Airborne Wind Energy Converters

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20470 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Autonomous Take-Off and Flight of a Tethered Aircraft for Airborne W

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20471 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Simplified model of offshore Airborne Wind Energy Converters

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20472 From: dave santos Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Facing the Stoppers

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20473 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Kiting Matters at OECD

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20474 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: Project Kite

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20475 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Wind-Energy History

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20476 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20477 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: WO/2016/085337 by Alfred van den Brink

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20478 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: Edison A. Founds

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20479 From: dave santos Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: Re: Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20480 From: dave santos Date: 8/18/2016
Subject: Tow-launch Updated

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20481 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/18/2016
Subject: Re: Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20482 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/18/2016
Subject: Kiting in the Solar Wind

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20483 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/18/2016
Subject: Plant Leaf Adaptations and AWES

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20484 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/18/2016
Subject: Wu and Wave

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20485 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/19/2016
Subject: Re: Kiting in the Solar Wind

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20486 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/19/2016
Subject: Re: Kiting in the Solar Wind

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20487 From: dave santos Date: 8/19/2016
Subject: Re: Plant Leaf Adaptations and AWES



Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20437 From: edoishi Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Attention Aerotecture...
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20438 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Re: Stephan Schnez of ABB Corporate Research to speak on AWE at UFre
Autonomous take-off and landing of a tethered aircraft: a simulation study 
Eric Nguyen Van, Lorenzo Fagiano and Stephan Schnez∗† 
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20439 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Killer LLJ? Fw: Role of Surface Inversion & Solar Gain in Maxwell TX
Attachments :
    This is a case of possible LLJ causation of the most tragic balloon accident in US history Saturday, with 16 dead. The accident weirdly happened within sight of kFarm (Maxwell Texas), perhaps by the same common LLJ pattern studied there by kPower for AWE. I myself almost died there, flying out of a trailer blown airborne by a freak tornadic event in 2014.

    It may be that this accident will long inform improved training of balloon pilots, based in part on Wayne, Cristina, KiteLab, and kPower's AWE LLJ studies, to reduce future loss-of-life in ballooning. Many past balloon accident witness reports seem to indicate an LLJ role, without making a precise identification. We'll see if the NTSB agrees, when investigation findings are made official in a final accident report in a few months.

    My LLJ comment submitted to the NTSB investigation-


    On Thursday, August 4, 2016 10:39 AM, dave santos <santos137@yahoo.com
    		  @@attachment@@
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20440 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
    Subject: Re: Killer LLJ? Fw: Role of Surface Inversion & Solar Gain in Maxwel
    My dad's reply below to my NTSB comment. He was an early storm chaser in WWII aircraft, in the 50s, and the first to photograph a tornado hook signature on a radar screen. His 1970 era airline pilot and skydiver's recollection shows how LLJs were anecdotally known across aviation, and were already known killers, and science is confirming and adding to our knowledge. A capability for an AWES to seek out and exploit Wind Speed Maxima, as Cristina calls the whole zoo of LLJs, is possibly an important criterion. Many early AWES concepts only presume a fixed operating altitude.

    -----  Dave Sr.-----

    Excellent thinking 'ijo. I was very aware of the fact that surface and near surface wind died when the sun stopped mixing (i.e. vertical currents) at sunset and sunrise. A large part of the reason was surface friction slows wind and the wind just above this accelerates with the lack of friction. And, as you state, often a surface inversion forms due to radiation at night. I had a United dispatcher explain this to me about 1970. There is shear in the boundary and skydivers need to be aware of it. I've seen people dumped. It's a factor for light slow planes. You make an excellent point. Hope the NTSB pays attention.
       When do you go back to Ilwaco?]]
     
    love,
    dad 





    On Thursday, August 4, 2016 12:02 PM, "dave santos santos137@yahoo.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    This is a case of possible LLJ causation of the most tragic balloon accident in US history Saturday, with 16 dead. The accident weirdly happened within sight of kFarm (Maxwell Texas), perhaps by the same common LLJ pattern studied there by kPower for AWE. I myself almost died there, flying out of a trailer blown airborne by a freak tornadic event in 2014.

    It may be that this accident will long inform improved training of balloon pilots, based in part on Wayne, Cristina, KiteLab, and kPower's AWE LLJ studies, to reduce future loss-of-life in ballooning. Many past balloon accident witness reports seem to indicate an LLJ role, without making a precise identification. We'll see if the NTSB agrees, when investigation findings are made official in a final accident report in a few months.

    My LLJ comment submitted to the NTSB investigation-


    On Thursday, August 4, 2016 10:39 AM, dave santos <santos137@yahoo.com


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20441 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
    Subject: Re: Killer LLJ? Fw: Role of Surface Inversion & Solar Gain in Maxwel
    Noting a possibly golden rule- In common LLJ conditions, if winds are dead calm at the surface, always take off upwind according to the predicted LLJ direction (prevailing wind direction). 

    Countless air accidents must have been caused by an unaccounted-for LLJ tailwind entered just after takeoff. The appearance of such mishaps would be a sudden mysterious loss of altitude and indicated airspeed, with no loss of power.


    On Thursday, August 4, 2016 1:00 PM, "dave santos santos137@yahoo.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    My dad's reply below to my NTSB comment. He was an early storm chaser in WWII aircraft, in the 50s, and the first to photograph a tornado hook signature on a radar screen. His 1970 era airline pilot and skydiver's recollection shows how LLJs were anecdotally known across aviation, and were already known killers, and science is confirming and adding to our knowledge. A capability for an AWES to seek out and exploit Wind Speed Maxima, as Cristina calls the whole zoo of LLJs, is possibly an important criterion. Many early AWES concepts only presume a fixed operating altitude.

    -----  Dave Sr.-----

    Excellent thinking 'ijo. I was very aware of the fact that surface and near surface wind died when the sun stopped mixing (i.e. vertical currents) at sunset and sunrise. A large part of the reason was surface friction slows wind and the wind just above this accelerates with the lack of friction. And, as you state, often a surface inversion forms due to radiation at night. I had a United dispatcher explain this to me about 1970. There is shear in the boundary and skydivers need to be aware of it. I've seen people dumped. It's a factor for light slow planes. You make an excellent point. Hope the NTSB pays attention.
       When do you go back to Ilwaco?]]
     
    love,
    dad 





    On Thursday, August 4, 2016 12:02 PM, "dave santos santos137@yahoo.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    This is a case of possible LLJ causation of the most tragic balloon accident in US history Saturday, with 16 dead. The accident weirdly happened within sight of kFarm (Maxwell Texas), perhaps by the same common LLJ pattern studied there by kPower for AWE. I myself almost died there, flying out of a trailer blown airborne by a freak tornadic event in 2014.

    It may be that this accident will long inform improved training of balloon pilots, based in part on Wayne, Cristina, KiteLab, and kPower's AWE LLJ studies, to reduce future loss-of-life in ballooning. Many past balloon accident witness reports seem to indicate an LLJ role, without making a precise identification. We'll see if the NTSB agrees, when investigation findings are made official in a final accident report in a few months.

    My LLJ comment submitted to the NTSB investigation-


    On Thursday, August 4, 2016 10:39 AM, dave santos <santos137@yahoo.com




    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20442 From: dave santos Date: 8/4/2016
    Subject: "new" RC winged box kites
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20443 From: dave santos Date: 8/5/2016
    Subject: Re: "new" RC winged box kites
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20444 From: Guillaume Ardoise Date: 8/6/2016
    Subject: Re: "new" RC winged box kites


    On Friday, August 5, 2016 2:12 PM, "dave santos santos137@yahoo.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20445 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/7/2016
    Subject: AWE fields of attention
    ​A comment regarding: 
    "Respect the laws of physics – No discussion of anything that would require the laws of physics to be changed or that requires technology that is not likely to be available in our lifetime."
    ​What​ process will police whether or not the "laws of physics" are being used? 
    ​A thinker might be onto a valuable path while inexpertly applying Nature's rules; I would not like to see the potential valuable path snuffed by some physics police; effort to find the correct physics to serve the potential valuable path could occur without loss of the perhaps creative potential valuable path to some AWE solution. 

    A comment regarding: "
    or that requires technology that is not likely to be available in our lifetime."​
    ​What process will decide the "likely"?    Whose "lifetime" will rule?  
    I would hope that AWE technical field will generally remain open to surprise. Having what might appear to some as beyond "our" lifetimes may well help some creative AWE worker to bring the matter to fruition within "our" lifetimes. May the youngest be given seeds of dreams!  ​


    A comment regarding "airborne" "only" :

    Kite systems are at once with a variety of "-borne" attributes. FFAWE is strictly airborne when air is the media for the opposing wing sets.   The kite systems that use soil and air to effect "-borne" include most of the contemporary announced AWES; such AWES are bi-media: soil and air; one wing set is in soil while the other wing set is in air.  The kite systems that use water and air to effect "-borne" have strong following; such systems are not "airborne" "only" machines, but rather are water and air "-borne".   Kite systems that use soil and water media to "-borne" their effectiveness are keen physics sisters to the AWE field via Jalbert, Santos, and others; neglect of the lessons being learned by Modesto would be a loss to the AWE space.     Similarly, neglect of FFAWE that uses only water as media would result in a hole in the AWE research space.  Indeed, further, there are energy kite systems that would use soil, water, and air media at once in order to effect good works.      A too-narrow forcing of "air"-only media could tend to bring losses of opportunity. 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20446 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/7/2016
    Subject: AWEpowerpoint

    AWEpowerport
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20448 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint
    Lets call this gentleman "Derek" since that name occurs in a file name. His accent seems Aussie, but like the GEICO gecko, such English accents can be rather hard to pinpoint. 

    Derek has been thinking about AWE at least six years and went so far as to develop a tabletop prototype based on the Xbox Kinect sensor system and a fast-acting winch steering unit. His notions of automation design are fragmentary, with some unrealistic assumptions evident, like AWES competing with towers at 300m high. This is not an economic height yet for wind towers, and AWES can simply fly in far better wind around 600m, the likely early regulatory ceiling. After that, the theoretic sweet spot according to Cristina is around 2km up, with towers left-in-the-dust.

    Derek's basic intuition is sound, that in principle one can reduce AWES control to a look-up table, where the kite robot looks at the system state and matches its response based on the closest pattern in a case-library by expert human pilots (related systems train neural-networks by human input). In practice its quite hard to give a kite system the sensory cues the pilot used, and very time-consuming to record all the possible states of wind, kite, and load; particularly individually rare but collectively common exception cases.

    Derek's latest flurry of didactic videos paint a bleak picture of current AWES designs with poor scaling potential as not competitive with conventional wind towers, but the overall impression created is that he is withholding disclosing some sort scheme to overcome the limitations. This is more or less consistent with kPower predictions that AWES must go far bigger and higher to beat regular HAWTs (excepting cases driven by low capital cost or remote or specialized operations).

    Can't wait to see what megascale AWES scheme Derek may come up with. Best of luck to him working out the details. Here is his Xbox Kinect AWES control hack-





    On Sunday, August 7, 2016 1:13 PM, "joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  



    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20449 From: Massimo Ippolito Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint
    Evviva, another one exposing a full understanding of the matter.
    who is this pompous ass?


    perhaps you miss this article:
    http://euanmearns.com/high-altitude-wind-power-reviewed/
    m.

    On 07/08/2016 22:05, joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy] wrote:
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20450 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: SYSTEM AND PROCESS FOR MANAGING AND CONTROLLING THE FLIGHT OF WI
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20451 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Glen R. Bailey and his kite system for surveillance
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20452 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint
    Massimo,

    We still don't know who this is, but he is doing ok for an isolated AWE developer, and we have not even seen his mysterious grand scheme yet. Probably shy, and surely not too pompous by Texan or Italian standards :)

    Thanks for the new link. Hoping we all do work together someday in an open simulation and testing program comparing all the leading ideas directly. Is there any news on the KiteGen SuperWing? 

    dave


    On Monday, August 8, 2016 4:32 PM, "Massimo Ippolito m.ippolito@kitegen.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    Evviva, another one exposing a full understanding of the matter.
    who is this pompous ass?


    perhaps you miss this article:
    http://euanmearns.com/high-altitude-wind-power-reviewed/
    m.

    On 07/08/2016 22:05, joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy] wrote:
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20453 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: GROUND STATION OF A TROPOSPHERIC WIND GENERATOR

    GROUND STATION OF A TROPOSPHERIC WIND GENERATOR

    (FR) STATION AU SOL D'UNE ÉOLIENNE TROPOSPHÉRIQUE


    Applicants:KITE GEN RESEARCH S.R.L. [IT/IT]; Corso Lombardia 63/D 10099 San Mauro Torinese (TO) (IT)
    Inventors:IPPOLITO, Massimo; (IT)
    Agent:GARAVELLI, Paolo; A.BRE.MAR. S.R.L. Via Servais 27 10146 Torino (IT)
    Priority Data:
    TO2015A000018 12.01.2015 IT
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20454 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: Glen R. Bailey and his kite system for surveillance
    The Open-AWE work-around for this patent is simply an electric motorized HG or PG, with the thrust/harvesting applied horizontally, in STOL operation.


    On Monday, August 8, 2016 6:03 PM, "Joe Faust joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20455 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: WindLift Update
    Advanced their website!
    Video overview of Windlift
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20456 From: dave santos Date: 8/8/2016
    Subject: Re: WindLift Update
    Having followed Rob's work from its KIS start, I am not thrilled its taken a million tax dollars for him to give up on soft kites in order to copy Makani's flygen, even down to the Joby motors (looks like a license agreement). Its as hard as ever to imagine any of the fancy AWES kiteplanes surviving years of operation to predicted payback (5yrs by a Makani estimate). How is it kite pros make soft power kites work for years, but can't make rigid power wings that survive a few days? After all, they are better pilots than any autopilot known, but still crash a few times a year.

    Two facts are undisputed- rigid wings are seen as attractive by AWE promoters and investors, and the world must soon know if the concerns over high capital cost and low reliability have been resolved. These companies do not provide public reliability-data, but extended absence of convincing endurance proofs will be telling enough. kPower's standing prediction, based on critical-path trends in general flight automation, is that acceptable (affordably insurable) kiteplanes of this sort will require rather more than a decade to perfect, and even then may not have any economic advantage over simpler groundgen AWES with rag-and-string only aloft. The win-win aspect is that the rigid kiteplanes are well represented in the ongoing contest to find AWE's iconic forms. WindLift will fill Makani's Wing7 niche as Makani focuses on the M600.

    The game goes on...






    On Monday, August 8, 2016 7:11 PM, "joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    Advanced their website!
    Video overview of Windlift
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20457 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/9/2016
    Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20458 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/9/2016
    Subject: Energy Matters discussions

    Some AWES matters in Energy Matters: 


    High Altitude Wind Power Reviewed
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20459 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/9/2016
    Subject: Pulling births kiting.
    Pulling births kiting. 
    ===============

    W1__________________W2
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20460 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/9/2016
    Subject: Re: Pulling births kiting.
    Tension (physics) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

     
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20461 From: snapscan_snapscan Date: 8/9/2016
    Subject: Re: AWEpowerpoint
    Dave wrote: "Can't wait to see what megascale AWES scheme Derek may come up with. "

    this might give you an idea:

    " the solution is multi-kite (crosswind), and a single onground generator. The Carousel has many good points, it's weaknesses are the land usage and the gigantic monolithic design. So a more dynamic, highly flexible design is required, that can be multiplied up into a wind farm. A mini-carousel or mini-roundabout. The diameter can be reduced to improve land usage. The elevated railway and trucks can be removed, and replaced by a simple hub and generator serving multi-kites. The magic roundabout"

    source:


    /cb
     
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20462 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Pulling births kiting.
    Anyone has been welcome to propose to others one or more models to represent what is a kite; no one is forced to practice anyone's model. The model for kite that involves tether-coupled wing sets in media was not formulated to fit anyone's particular strand of thought; use the model or not, no problem; I am finding large energy-kite opportunities as I practice that model.

        Criticism that does not respect the offered freedom to choose among models does an unneeded disrespect of the facts of presentation. When someone comes up with a model for kite that attracts me more than the stated model, then I will use the offered model.  

        Also, models for kite may have usefulness within a certain domain and not in some other domain; a practitioner of kiting may well practice the use of more than one model to effect grasp of challenges. 

    Propose models in the forum AirborneWindEnergy as you wish, or on any other platform on the Internet.                ~ JoeF
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20463 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Pulling births kiting.
    If an outlier in some certain model for a realm challenges one, then consider restricting the domain of application of that certain model. 

    The remaining domain of model application may ease the way to progress. 

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ Scientific_modelling

    ============================== =======================
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20464 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Moderator reports
    The AWES forum is founded on a premise that at least I do not know everything about energy kite systems; the forum is a platform for solution seekers and sharers.  My personal thrust in publishing is to support those who would share the graces they receive during their energy-kite adventures. Simple. Direct.  

    Indeed, it is an easy logic proof that any non-divine human person knows almost nothing compared to what is actual.​  Mining the gold ore for gold is a joyous work for me; if you have some ore that might have some AWE-gold in it, consider posting on the Internet someplace; I aim to seek out such sharing and give some organization to such matter and give some searchable presence within the AWES forum and its slave EnergyKiteSystems.net   Let me know of gems to include in such process; TIA.   Or just post your AWE ore as a titled message in the forum. 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20465 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Moderator reports
    I consider it a special privilege to listen to anyone's kite-energy adventure; share your AWE glances someplace, anyplace: trust that I'll be examining your sharing for gems in order forward credited notes to others. 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20466 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Facing the Stoppers

    While energy kiting moves forward to do good works by the use of kite systems, there will be a facing of counterpoints and stoppers. The tension and competition that may arise from naysayers, stoppers, and counterpointers may for some be a source for creative energy-kite development.  


    One source of counterpointing hitting the wind industry in general may be culled for creative launch points: 

    STOP THESE THINGS
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20467 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: ARC-TYPE WING WITH IMPROVED SHOULDERS
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20468 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: A Small-Scale Prototype to Study the Take-Off of Tethered Rigid Airc
    A Small-Scale Prototype to Study the Take-Off of Tethered Rigid Aircrafts for Airborne Wind Energy

    August 2016
    Authors: Lorenzo Fagiano and others:

    Lorenzo Fagiano, Eric Nguyen-Van, Felix Rager, Christian Ohler
    At the moment, I do not know how available are readings of the paper.
    Someone might post links to the paper or otherwise lead up to the paper.
    ==================================
    Notice how the title of the paper has air wings tethered to something which that something is in some media, presumably Earth's ground as the paper's abstract mentions "ground station" which station involves complex parts including parts that interface with the Earth's ground.
    ================================================
    This topic thread is opened for careful study and discussion of what is written in the subject article. The discussion may be spread over days, weeks, months, years ...
    ================================================
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20469 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Simplified model of offshore Airborne Wind Energy Converters
    Maybe a non-pay gate access to full paper:

    Airborne Wind Energy Systems: A review of the technologies

     
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20470 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Autonomous Take-Off and Flight of a Tethered Aircraft for Airborne W

    Autonomous Take-Off and Flight of a Tethered Aircraft for Airborne Wind Energy

    Article · August 2016

    1st Lorenzo Fagiano

    2nd Eric Nguyen-Van

    3rd Felix Rager

    4ty Stephan Schnez

    5th Christian Ohler


    Abstract

    A control design approach to achieve fully autonomous take-off and flight maneuvers with a tethered aircraft is presented and demonstrated in real-world flight tests with a small-scale prototype. A ground station equipped with a controlled winch and a linear motion system accelerates the aircraft to take-off speed and controls the tether reeling in order to limit the pulling force. This setup corresponds to airborne wind energy systems with ground-based energy generation and rigid aircrafts. A simple model of the aircraft's dynamics is introduced and its parameters are identified from experimental data. A model-based, hierarchical feedback controller is then designed, whose aim is to manipulate the elevator, aileron and propeller inputs in order to stabilize the aircraft during the take-off and to achieve figure-of-eight flight patterns parallel to the ground. The controller operates in a fully decoupled mode with respect to the ground station. Parameter tuning and stability/robustness aspect are discussed, too. The experimental results indicate that the controller is able to achieve satisfactory performance and robustness, notwithstanding its simplicity, and confirm that the considered take-off approach is technically viable and solves the issue of launching this kind of airborne wind energy systems in a compact space and at low additional cost. 

    Abstract source HERE.

    ============================================================


    Someone might have an effective reading link for the paper. 


    This topic thread invites eventual careful study and discussion of gems in the article. 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20471 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Simplified model of offshore Airborne Wind Energy Converters
    The paper: 
    Airborne Wind Energy Systems: A review of the technologies 
    by Antonello Cherubini, Andrea Papini, Rocco Vertechy, Marco Fontana
    receives my comment here: 

    The plural form AWESs for airborne wind energy systems was used; elsewhere, often the "s" is dropped even while meaning plurality.
    ================================
    The abstract stated " a new class of wind energy converters" where the "new" seems not to have recognized the ancient fact of converting wind energy with tethered wings or aircraft.

    Similarly, the abstract did not recognize that research on AWESs was done prior to the mid seventies of the 1900s when it stated: "Research on AWESs started in the mid seventies". 
    ================================
    Notice of the papers acronyms: GG-AWES  and GG-AWESs
    "Ground-Generator Airborne Wind Energy Systems (GG-AWES) electrical energy is produced exploiting aerodynamic forces that are transmitted from the aircraft to the ground through ropes. As previously anticipated, GG-AWESs ..."

    And: Fly-Gen AWES (FG-AWES)   and FG-AWESs.
    ===============================
     The article did not recognize that moving-ground-station AWESs are ancient and currently explored. 
    ==============================
    The paper seems to be biased to hyped and loud activity while missing Open-AWE working prototypes. Such might be expected, as interview and research into the less-loud AWE centers of effort may cost more research time on the part of the authors. Hopefully, one day, a robust comprehensive coverage of our AWE realm will occur.  The paper is well organized and exercises high level language efficiently.  Year: 2015. Coverage grade: I give a B; how and why such as kPower, Inc. and others are absented remains a puzzle and puts the article in question in an important way; investors should go beyond the paper before deciding where to put funds. 
    ==============================
    The authors missed high-level clarity as they tried to distinguish matters about crosswind, non-crosswind, apparent wind, and absolute wind; such confusion seems to be evident well beyond the article. Careful students will go beyond this article to have clarity about AWES and such flows. 
    ==============================
    The article's history note about first AWES to be tested missed facts while giving such unfortunately to a proud testing, but certainly not the first test of an AWES. My first blush is that the authors gave little question over historical firsts as they may have simply believed text by the involved company.  Understandable when appreciating that the authors well evidently highly busy with different AWE matters to get the article completed.
    ==============================
    We have covered somewhat the challenges in the paragraph titled: "7.1. Effect of flying mass".  Some statements in the lead paragraph of that section hold serious error.  Be ready for deep rewrite of such upon review by scientists.  [ ] 
    ==============================
    While noting some tether-drag matters, an unfortunate statement of getting zero drag for the tether in lower section of dancing tethered wings was carried.  No, such tether section will still have non-zero drag and also negative lift. 
    =============================
    Overall:  Happy to see a strong article as this produced and published!  Not an easy work. Thanks to the authors!!!  May your article get many many readings!
    ============================



    ---In AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com, <joefaust333@gmail.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20472 From: dave santos Date: 8/10/2016
    Subject: Re: Facing the Stoppers
    For comparison, I passed thru Sweetwater Texas today, which now bills itself as the "wind energy leader of North America", with around 2000 new turbines stretching to the horizons, what an incredible sight. Rather than considered a blight,  to most Texans they seem to complete this vast flatland and are only a source of pride. Just up the highway is Lubbock, whose major attraction in its otherwise sparse Cultural District is the Wind Power Center, with 40,000 sq ft of inside exhibition space and 10 acres of outdoor turbines, from small-to-giant, ancient-to-modern. This part of world, at least, loves its windmills as much as the Dutch.

    On the other extreme. what we are seeing in South Australia is a temporary gap in balancing the national grid combined with sincere NIMBY opposition. Between these extreme favorable and unfavorable HAWTs cases, most other cases fall in-between.


    On Wednesday, August 10, 2016 9:32 AM, "joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    While energy kiting moves forward to do good works by the use of kite systems, there will be a facing of counterpoints and stoppers. The tension and competition that may arise from naysayers, stoppers, and counterpointers may for some be a source for creative energy-kite development.  

    One source of counterpointing hitting the wind industry in general may be culled for creative launch points: 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20473 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/11/2016
    Subject: Kiting Matters at OECD

    Anticipating eventual growth of OECD's awareness of working kite systems for the benefit of Earth, this topic thread stands as a kind of collection place to trace OECD's non-empty interface with AWES. 

    ================================================

    Preamble:

    Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia for a peek at OECD.


    Then: 

    LIst of country members: 


    List of OECD countries by GDP per capita - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    ====================================

    This topic thread invites following and discussing working kiting within the awareness of OECD. As AWES grows to affect what concerns OECD, then it is suspected that OECD will give evidence of its awareness and treatment of energy-kite opportunities.  

    ====================================

    http://www.oecd.org/  is a home web site for OECD. 

    ====================================


    Start point: 

    "kite" in OECD sear tool on August 11, 2016:  115 hits, but few hits are related to our interests.

    One: 

    http://www.oecd.org/innovation/inno/37915674.pdf     


    My first impression is that OECD shows some awareness of greening shipping via traction by kiting.    

    E.g., https://www.oecd.org/sti/ind/48365856.pdf   mentions kiting as option for greening shipping. 


    ============================================

    When any of us is aware of an OECD awareness of working kiting, then consider posting in this topic thread.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20474 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/11/2016
    Subject: Re: Project Kite
    New home page in new folder for Project Kite:
    Project Kite

     
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20475 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/16/2016
    Subject: Wind-Energy History
    Energy kite systems fits into the broad spectrum of wind-energy history. Nature's energy-kite systems served the pre-history scene; and the same inspires many humans seeking to advance artificial energy-kite systems' designs. This topic thread invites wind-energy history including energy-kite systems. 

    Without prejudice to timeline matters, a random starter: 
    http://mragheb.com/NPRE%20475%20Wind%20Power%20Systems/Wind%20Generators%20History.pdf
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20476 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/16/2016
    Subject: Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers

    Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers

    Project proposal:

    Aeolus Kite Generator


    ================================

    He notes: 

    2nd NW Washington Sustainability Challenge

    NWIRC
    April 2014

    2nd Place for the co-invention and submission of Aeolus Kite Generator, a kite generator system that harnesses the power of wind to generate power for your home or business.


    Starting  September 2014

    Brad lists for himself: 

    • Electrical Designer at Hargis Enginees

     
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20477 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/17/2016
    Subject: WO/2016/085337 by Alfred van den Brink

     Alfred van den Brink, Technical Director of E-Kite, Barneveld (NL),


    WO/2016/085337 
    WIND POWER GENERATION SYSTEM
    AND METHOD OF OPERATING THE SAME


    front page image
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20478 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/17/2016
    Subject: Edison A. Founds

    GB279051


    https://www.google.com/patents/US1620882

    Aeroplane Kite


    Edison Alva Founds


    =======================================

    Comments: 


    Impeller on biplane airplane-like tethered wing;

    foundation kite system ready for adapting to do good works!


    ================

    Publication number US1620882 A

    Publication type Grant

    Publication date Mar 15, 1927

    Filing date Oct 18, 1926

    Priority date Oct 18, 1926

    Inventors Edison A Founds

    Original Assignee Robert B Grimes

    ================================
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20479 From: dave santos Date: 8/17/2016
    Subject: Re: Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers
    This "Aeolus" AWE project from 2014 would have been completed by now, but we do not have any results. It was an ambitious concept on a short timeline with limited resources. 

    Add Western Washington University to the long list of academic AWE players, and hope they continue further. Bellingham happens to be Dave Lang's town, a nice natural connection.


    .
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20480 From: dave santos Date: 8/18/2016
    Subject: Tow-launch Updated
    Tow-assisted glider launch continues to evolve as the simplest most cost-effective Open-AWE means to get up to working AWES altitude. In principle, a mighty kite farm can early-launch in cascaded stages, starting with a small step-towed kite. AWES E-VTOL and catapult designs will be hard-pressed to beat the proven baseline economic and flight performance of advanced winch-tow practice.

    Here is an informative expert overview and update of ongoing tow-assist progress-
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20481 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/18/2016
    Subject: Re: Brad Nardone and Caden Sowers
    Project Aeolus Description
    {PDF)
    The  description had forecast demonstration dates: 5/31/15 – 6/6/15
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20482 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/18/2016
    Subject: Kiting in the Solar Wind
    Kiting in the solar wind?

    Tethered sets of wings in various arrangements are invited to be discussed. Anchor wings may be set on planets, asteroids, space vehicles; or anchor wings may be in free-flight. Opposing-to-anchor wings wings may be passively or actively controlled; similarly for anchor wings in the kite system. Tethers and bridling may be explored. Scaling is open for discussion. Experiments may be openly planned. Materials? Interface with other long-tether space experiments? Space elevator ?  Electrodynamic tethers?  Tether satellites? Satellites on tethers? Concerns of Tethers Unlimited?

    What may be learned from this topic thread might apply to interstellar space kiting. 

    Applications may be described and discussed. Travel? Power generation? Data collection? Communications? Benefits to life? Purposes?  Good works? Surprises?
     
    Already discussed some has been asteroid re-routing kiting using the solar wind; that may continue. 
    Slightly already in the mention has been FFAWE (with "A" replaced with solar wind). 

    The topic is open to multiple wings within opposing wing sets; and to multiple tethers and tether complexes to form solar wind kites in view.  Consider spider webs and other lattice and matrix complexes forming the kite in one's view for discussion. Consider setting up huge or tiny rotations during the involved kite flight. Hub designs? Wear? Sturdiness? Wing design?  Tether design?
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20483 From: Joe Faust Date: 8/18/2016
    Subject: Plant Leaf Adaptations and AWES
    Toiling in the garden of plant leaf adaptations may invite creative kite system applications and designs. This topic thread space is a kind of home for exploring plant leaf design and adaptations to wind, climate, purpose, survival, etc., with an open eye to AWES opportunities. 

    Form is just part of the realm. Function, growth, response to stimulation, changes to respect wind force, changes to respect temperature, response to injury, diurnal changes, etc. 

    ===============================
    Start: 
    http://tinyurl.com/LeafFormsKiteWingOpportunities 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20484 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/18/2016
    Subject: Wu and Wave
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20485 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/19/2016
    Subject: Re: Kiting in the Solar Wind
    SOHO
    and its data supply may play toward this solar-wind AWES topic thread. 

    The solar-wind kiting adventure may color terrestrial-AWES jaunts. 
    Even be ready for some of us to come up with hybrid AWES that involve both media of solar wind at Earth-atmosphere wind in a kite.  
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20486 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 8/19/2016
    Subject: Re: Kiting in the Solar Wind
     Fine tuning momentum exchanges from massive particle impacts in solar-wind kiting may be accompanied by notes respecting non-massive ray pressures on kite parts.  Perhaps we could expand the topic to "solar wind and ray flow".  The velocities of the rays are much higher than the velocities of the massive particles. Physicists are invited to clarify velocities and potential results on kite parts. How the kite uses the impacts of the massive and non-massive flows will depend on kite-part configuration and control. 

    The direction of the media matters. The energy of the media (particles and rays and photos) [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_ray ]      Just how the solar-founded well-directed flow will play with the non-solar-founded cosmic streams in a kite may become a careful study. 

    Materials easily damaged by solar-wind and cosmic rays and photons may have limited utility in some solar-wind kites. 

    Note: "kite" includes all parts in a kite; e.g., if a kite has a sensor in its complex, then that sensor's mass, at least, affects the entire system. Further, a wing in a kite might have a sensor in such wing; such sensor then would be part of the wing in such kite. 
    kite :: complex of tensed-tethered opposing wing sets. 
     
    Exploring: Will materials permit a surround-sun-full-ring tether solar satellite? The solar wind would press the ring away from the sun. The ring might be only tether where the simple tether at once plays in all its parts opposing wing sets and coupling tether to give kite. Materials may or may not permit such a solar-satellite ring kite. And my memory seems to bring up the related matter, but in kite terms: solar-wind shell-satellite kite where the shell is either net mesh or full shell of various porosity; the simple ring is a reduced instance; a full 2-D shell ball surface kite is intimated.  

    Caution: There are probably solar-wind kites that are to be avoided. Some kites in this realm might be conceived that might be life-threatening, perhaps Earth-orbiting degrading or similarly for the orbits of other planets.  Knowing what solar-wind kiting to avoid may be part of this topic thread. 
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 20487 From: dave santos Date: 8/19/2016
    Subject: Re: Plant Leaf Adaptations and AWES
     As Goethe reported in his Metamorphosis of Plants, the most exotic plant parts are creative elaborations of a fundamental leaf archetype. Operationally, a common leaf is a hybrid of solar and wind functions.

    We further note that the leaf or petal is a kite unit corresponding to a kite farm kixel. Its branching vein structure converges into the overall dendritic topology of the entire plant, as a single metakite in its wind field. Most leaves evolved to dump wind, by edge-mounted stems. Many do have stems more centrally-mounted to better support horizontal area against gravity, and these either furl in gusts or grow in sheltered locations. Some leaves are even highly optimized glider or rotor flying machines.

    In the most esoteric topological interpretation, leaves are all one interconnected wing system with the Earth itself as a kite unit (flying in the same atmospheric gas bubble, with mirrored forces like a tethered wing pair). Soaring leaves are IFO kites with their own internal anchor masses, invisibly tethered by gravity to Earth. AWES seem to be a natural progression of plant-like structure tethered with our planet.


    On Thursday, August 18, 2016 10:10 PM, "Joe Faust joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com  
    Toiling in the garden of plant leaf adaptations may invite creative kite system applications and designs. This topic thread space is a kind of home for exploring plant leaf design and adaptations to wind, climate, purpose, survival, etc., with an open eye to AWES opportunities. 

    Form is just part of the realm. Function, growth, response to stimulation, changes to respect wind force, changes to respect temperature, response to injury, diurnal changes, etc. 

    ===============================
    Start: 
    http://tinyurl.com/LeafFormsKiteWingOpportunities